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Christofascist Religious Censors Outraged at Islamofascist Censorship

Iron Issues Irony AlertIn the Netherlands, parliamentarian Geert Wilders has been pushing to ban the Quran from his country because in his view it is “fascist.” Muslim groups, some of which have been pushing to censor Danish comics that upset them, are incensed that Wilders would support banning the Quran, and so they bring a case to a Dutch court seeking to censor Wilders. The Dutch court rules that in advocating the criminalization of the Quran, Wilders has committed a religious speech crime. Wilders’ reaction to all this? He says his prosecution marks a “black day for myself and for freedom of speech” and is an “attack on the freedom of expression…. Participation in the public debate has become a dangerous activity. If you give your opinion, you risk being prosecuted.”

I count four loop-de-loops in there.

Oh, those silly Europeans. We Americans would never do that! And by never, I mean… ok, fairly often. Take Republican outsider and recent presidential candidate Albert Howard, who follows up his congratulations to Geert Wilders for having “exercised his fundamental human right of freedom of expression and spoken out”… with a call to ban the Quran.

Loop!

16 comments to Christofascist Religious Censors Outraged at Islamofascist Censorship

  • Jon

    I am currently reading the Quran, not just taking someone else’s word for what it says, and it is a document without equal. To the exclusion of all other forms of thought or belief the Quran is supreme. In order to further the Quran you may lie, murder, persecute, tax(jizya)
    and generally make others lives a living hell…..as long as they are not Muslims. As a matter of fact if you are Muslim you should not even associate with non Muslims. You may however marry a nine year old girl. If a Muslim kills a dhimmi(non Muslim) he must pay a fine.

    By the way… if you don’t agree with any of this, it really doesn’t matter. Sharia is coming our way.

    It really seems pretty Fascist to me!

    The difference between Sharia and law based on western Judeo/Christian ethics is obvious. Judeo/Christian ethics allows for dissent, as long as it is not enforced by murder. And Shari allows murder for dissent. They cannot co-exist, you choose which one stays!

  • Jon

    Can’t you come up with something more current?
    Show me in the New Testament where there is similar language to the Quran, concerning the treatment of outsiders.

    • Froot Loop

      What, Jon? I repeat: Where in the Bible is freedom of expression protected? WHERE?

      As for the New Testament, how about the righteous throwing of non-Christians into a lake of fire to be tormented forever. Also, it’s MIGHTY convenient for you to overlook the Old Testament that conservative Christians love so much for it’s anti-gay screeds. Plenty o’ holy genocide in there.

  • Jon

    Your ignorance is unbounded! I am talking about the here and now not the hereafter. Yes the New testament does say that there will be a firey reward for those that don’t accept salvation. The important difference, the one that matters here and now is that the Quran encourages it’s followers to enslave those not willing to convert. The New Testament has this to say:
    Matthew 10
    “Whatever town or village you enter, search for some worthy person there and stay at his house until you leave. As you enter the home, give it your greeting. If the home is deserving, let your peace rest on it; if it is not, let your peace return to you. If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake the dust off your feet when you leave that home or town. I tell you the truth, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town. I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves.

    Whereas the Quran says:
    IX/5: Then when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-(jizya)
    due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

    This verse tells us that muslims are free to convert non-muslims by force and brutality. If unsuccessful in doing so, they are free to kill.

    IX/73: Oh Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey’s end.

    IX/5: Then when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor- due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

    This verse tells us that muslims are free to convert non-muslims by force and brutality. If unsuccessful in doing so, they are free to kill.

    IX/73: Oh Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey’s end.

    If you are unable to see the difference in how Chritianiy works and how Islam work through these example..I suggestt that you travel to Yemen and strike up a similar argument with the Muslims there.
    What the Bible says about sin, all sin, not just homosexual sin.. is:
    Ephesians 2
    As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature[a] and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath. But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved.

    Certianly doesn’t sound like one person is better than another to me. Don’t let your hate for Chritianity cloud your mind. Read and think, don’t just react in ignorance.

    • Froot Loop

      So, then, the difference between the Quran and the Bible is that Quran says to kill infidels now, whereas the Bible says to torture them later? Oh. BIG difference there, Jon! That explains why the Spanish Inquisition was in the hereafter… yah.

  • Jon

    Hence the name Fruit Loop.
    The Bible allows you to make the decision, it allows for free will. The Spanish inquisition was not Biblical, and cannot be justified using Biblical means.
    If you still refuse to acknowledge the difference, give me an example of one Muslim country that has developed the kind of Government that we enjoy in this country.One that promote a plurality of though and action. I think you will find that almost all the totalitarian regimes are Muslim. Iran, Sudan, Yemen, Lybia, Chad, Somalia, Uganda, Pakistan…any of those countries even closely approximate the level of freedom that we enjoy in this Country with it’s Christian history and basis?

  • Froot Loop

    Jon, the Spanish Inquisition WAS justified using Biblical means. That was the whole point.

  • Jon

    Froot, you can justify anything using the Bible, if you extract verses out of context. If what you are talking about were true then there would still be a Inquisition going on today. People are fallible, and they will fail under every institution, which is why under our form of Government there are checks and balances. As well thought out as it is, and as self correcting as it is, there have still been abuses committed in the name of the US. Does that mean that this Country condones such actions? No! They were aberrations, the conduct of fallible men.

    You seem to be unwilling or incapable of distinguishing between core beliefs and the distortion of beliefs to justify behavior.

    What Islam offers is a system that PROMOTES violence against unbelievers. In many ways it is similar to Nazism with it’s anti-Semitic nature. Which is why during WWII the Nazi’s and the Caliphate were allies.

    Expulsion of theologies that espouse violence, commit violence and plan the overthrow of Democratic governments, is an entirely right and proper response.

    Show me a place in the modern world where Christian Ideology is being used to murder and terrorize, and I would equally denounce that behavior.

    Come up with something better thought out! Your agrument is like, “And your mother wears army pants”.

    • Jon, you can justify anything using the Quran, if you extract verses out of context.

      And is there not torture going on, organized by people who believed they were waging a war in the name of the Christian God against evil Islam?

  • Jon

    “Jon, you can justify anything using the Quran, if you extract verses out of context.”

    You haven’t read the Quran have you? There is NO context in the Quran. In order to understand the context you would need to read one of the commentaries to flesh out the details. The Quran is ordered in Sura’s that are placed longest to shortest. There is however plenty of call to Jihad. By the way, you as an a-theist, polytheist, animist, Satanist, are considered much worse than a Christian or a Jew.

    “And is there not torture going on, organized by people who believed they were waging a war in the name of the Christian God against evil Islam?”

    Can’t speak for everyone Frooty! But I see this as being more probable: There are people waging war on Islamic Terrorist who incidentally are Christians. I know of no one that believes that as Christians we have a God given duty to eradicate Muslims……The same way that there are Police that fight crime, who incidentally are also Christian. However there are no Jihadist that are Muslims incidental to the war/Jihad.

    You know what they say about Pearls.

    • Froot Loop

      There is NO context in the Quran? Really? It fell out of the sky? It’s about people who live in isolation chambers? You’ve jumped about a dozen sharks here, Jon.

  • Jim

    Well, I have read the Quran. Surah 6 tells Muslims to leave people who disagree with their beliefs alone and let them think what they want to think:

    66. But thy people reject this, though it is the truth. Say: “Not mine is the responsibility for arranging your affairs;

    67. For every message is a limit of time, and soon shall ye know it.”

    68. When thou seest men engaged in vain discourse about Our signs, turn away from them unless they turn to a different theme. If Satan ever makes thee forget, then after recollection, sit not thou in the company of those who do wrong.

    69. On their account no responsibility falls on the righteous, but (their duty) is to remind them, that they may (learn to) fear Allah.

    70. Leave alone those who take their religion to be mere play and amusement, and are deceived by the life of this world.

  • HareTrinity

    As I understand it, Huhammad/Mohammed/etc starts with a society being formed that is very open minded. So long as people submit to the rule of the Qu’ran they’re allowed to do whatever they want, the implication being that this is a rite of citizenship that basically covers the “I know what the law here is” much like the I Agree statements on computer programs that no one reads. After doing that the citizens could be practicing Jews or whatever.

    Later on it becomes a much more punitive community that does deal out executions for a lack of obedience, but I get the feeling that for the modern Muslim this is much akin to the Old Testament; an outdated piece that reflects the era more than the belief system.

    At least, that’s what I thought the book said happened… Want me to go ask some Muslims, or should we leave them out of this?

  • Jon

    Hare: In the beginning of Mohammed’s ministries, while he was in Mecca and early on during his time in Medina, there was a much more conciliatory tone in verses from the Quran. After his conquering Mecca the tone changes. The Casual reader can’t place the origin of the verses, because the Sura’s are organized by length, not by the order of the revelation. Without the commentaries(the sira and hadith literature) the context of the revelation can be very obscure. There is also the issue of the Satanic Verses, where Mohammed uttered Satan’s words as though they were God’s. There is also confusion where a previously revealed verse was abrogated by a subsequently revealed verse, we might be fooled into believing the first verse is true while in fact Muslims know that it has been abrogated.

    Many of the milder verses, such as the one Jim quoted were in fact abrogated by later harsher verses. Because there is no context contained within the Quran itself(only the the sira and hadith literature) and because the Quran is not written in chronological order, stating what the Quran says or doesn’t say can be a source of confusion.

    • Froot Loop

      Many of the Bible’s milder verses, such as the ones that Jon quoted are in fact abrogated by harsher verses.

      Because there is no context contained within Jon, what he says can be a source of confusion.

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