The United States is on the verge of approving an expedited shipment of cluster bombs fitted onto the heads of rockets that Israel could fire into Lebanon, according to the New York Times. Reuters writes that “the rockets, while likely effective against hidden missile launchers, would also likely cause civilian casualties if used against targets in populated areas.” That’s because each rocket contains multiple grenades that are dispersed over a wide area before they explode.
These weapons are blunt instruments, used to wreak death and destruction over a large area with imprecise targeting. Wherever Israel uses them, civilians who are nearby will be killed.
Some State Department officials are trying to block the sale because these weapons are so particularly prone to creating high numbers of civilian deaths, but as a whole, the Bush Administration is pushing to get the weapons to Israel as soon as possible. A note would come along with the weapons, urging Israel to be careful with them.
That warning label is as likely to be effective as George W. Bush’s request that Israel show “restraint” in its attacks against Lebanon. That request went unheeded. The fact that Israel has a history of using these sorts of weapons to create massive numbers of civilian deaths, going back as far as the 1980s, is further cause for concern.
The real message that is being sent to Israel with this shipment of American-made cluster bombs is that, no matter how much officials from the Bush White House say that they want the violence to end, they are actually more interested in keeping the war going. Our government’s claim that it wants the fighting to end is exposed as an ugly lie when we send hurried shipments of weapons for one side in the war to use ASAP.
Can you substantiate that so-called “fact” of Israel wantonly killing civilians? From everything I’ve been able to gather, the reverse is true: Israel goes out of its way to avoid killing civilians, but those attacking Israel have no such cares.
Well, gee, Michael, you could look at the fact that, in the first week of this war, 95 percent of the Lebanese casualties were civilians. How would that show Israel going out of its way to avoid killing civilians, Michael?
Then, you could actually read the article that I’ve linked to here, which cites the history of Israel using these weapons against civilians in the 1980s: “the United States maintained a moratorium in the 1980s on selling cluster munitions to Israel, after it learned civilians in Lebanon had been killed with the weapons during the 1982 Israeli invasion.”
For the United States government to put a moratorium on sending these weapons to Israel, you know it had to be bad.
We know the Hisbollah intentionally places their rockets in populated areas to use civilains as human shields. One of their latest tricks has been to take their rocket launchers into Christian villages to fire into Israel. Christian villages with no history of aiding Hizbollah have complained they are afraid when this paramilitary comes into their villages and starts firing missles, as it is well known Israel will destroy rocket launchers whether they’re in populated areas or not.
My understanding about cluster bombs is they are primarily a weapon to be used against people, not buildings or military targets. These were used in the ‘shock and awe’ campaign in Iraq with subsequant photos of mutitlated children broadcast all over the Arab world–they are not at all squeemish about publishing pictures of bloody children or putting them on television over and over. The anger here on the Arab street was so thick you could feel it walking down the street, and was followed shortly by al-Jazeera in Baghdad being blown up.(accidently, of course, after all, someone from Reuters was killed in the Palestine Hotel at the same time). If Israel uses this type of weapon now, they will regret it.
The other problem with cluster bombs is the bomblets don’t all explode. The problem of unexploded ordnance in Iraq was responsible for many injuries, expecially with children who would find these devices and play with them. The land surrounding the Israeli border is already filled with buried munitions ready to go off and injure children. Select areas have been cleared of landmines, such as the baptism site of jesus, at great expense and with help from the international community. All we need is more unexploded ordnance in this region that will be there in the soil for years and years in the future, long after this latest dustup is forgotten.
Michael,
You noticeably made first use of the word “wantonly” in this conversation. Peregrin doesn’t say anything about wanton anything. So let’s remove the word “wantonly” and restate your sentence:
“Can you substantiate that so-called “fact†of Israel killing civilians?”
Well, yes. Israel has killed civilians. Lots of them. Source: New York Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, etc etc etc.
Now, back to that word “wantonly.” A “wanton” action is traditionally one engaged in with lustful purpose. So, golly, you’re setting up a straw man. Do Israeli generals get stiffies as they order the airstrikes that will kill civilians? I can’t definitely say “no,” since I’m not there to eye the military trousers in question, but most probably not. Why should Peregrin Wood have to substantiate Israeli stiffies?
Now let’s return from your wanton world of lustful bombing campaigns to reality. Is the real question here whether Israelis explicitly state their intention to kill civilians? Well, of course they don’t. They say, “gosh, we’d like to not kill civilians, but they’re in the way of our military targets, so here we go, whoopsie, sorry.”
Hezbollah says “gosh, we’d like to not kill civilians, but we must continue to do so in order to further our military goals, so here we go.”
Osama bin Laden says “gosh, I’d like to stop killing civilians, but I must continue to do so in order to further my political and religious goals, so here we go.”
Now, what’s the difference? For Osama bin Laden, it’s political and religious goals, as opposed to strictly military ones, so there’s one difference. But between Hezbollah and Israel, each of which has sworn to absolutely eliminate the other as a corporate entity as its military goal, what’s the difference? That Hezbollah doesn’t say “whoopsie, my bad” every time it kills civilians, and that Israel does? If you kill your kid and say you’re sorry, is that OK?
This seems to me to be a very, very fine distinction you’re making. If that’s the distinction you’re trying to make. If it’s not, and you really think that terrorists get stiffies, Israelis don’t get stiffies, and it’s all about the erection, well then…
Fact is almost all of the Israeli’s equipment is American made. Watching the news today I saw the Isreal military in posession of UH-60 Black Hawk helicopters and M1A1 Abrams tanks. These are two of the most advanced pieces of military hardware in existence to date.
So, knowing that most everything Isreal is using has Made in U.S.A. stamped on it, am I really surprised when I hear that we’re now going to send them cluster bombs? Not at all.
Oh, I was listening to NPR while in the car today and guess what? Isreal attacked a convoy escorted by UN Peacekeepers today, killing three civilians and wounding ten.
And my dad also told me that the United States vetoed a Russian proposed three day humanitarian cease-fire in the middle east.
Let the good times roll.
~ Damen
That’s right, Damen, and guess who told that convoy that they would have safe transit? Israel. The Israeli military knew exactly what that convoy was, and where it was going, and that there were no Hebollah fighters in it. Those people were fleeing the Israeli invasion of their town, and then Israel had the balls to kill them on their way out. Disgusting.
Just as disgusting – Hezbollah’s selfish use of the deaths of Lebanese to promote itself. This whole war stinks, no matter which side you’re on.
Hizbollah intentionally kills civilians. They do not make any secret of it. Their stated goal is to kill all Jews.