Retired CIA Officer John Kiriakou was part of the interrogation team that participated in waterboarding. Here, according to Kiriakou, is what happened:
He described Abu Zubaida as ideologically zealous, defiant and uncooperative — until the day in mid-summer when his captors strapped him to a board, wrapped his nose and mouth in cellophane and forced water into his throat in a technique that simulates drowning.
The waterboarding lasted about 35 seconds before Abu Zubaida broke down, according to Kiriakou, who said he was given a detailed description of the incident by fellow team members. The next day, Abu Zubaida told his captors he would tell them whatever they wanted, Kiriakou said.
There you are. Now we all know exactly what the United States government under the Bush administration has done to its detainees.
This renders completely bogus George W. Bush’s assertion that he can’t talk about the issue, because for strategic reasons he doesn’t want The Enemy to know about what the U.S. does to its detainees. The Enemy has of course known for years that the U.S. waterboards its detainees, and undoubtedly they’ve prepared for it, but now they know exactly in what that procedure consists.
This renders completely bogus Michael Mukasey’s assertion that he can’t talk about the issue of waterboarding because he a) doesn’t know what it is, and b) doesn’t know what form of it the U.S. government engaged in. Unless you’ve started an I-don’t-read-the-newspapers policy to follow your new boss, Mr. Mukasey, now you know.
We now have a retired CIA officer telling the world the exact procedure of strapping a detainee to a board, covering his mouth and nose with cellophane and forcing water down his throat, for 35 seconds, until he broke. 18 U.S.C. 2340 describes torture as, among other things, an interrogation procedure that produces the perception of “imminent death.” That’s what the described procedure is designed to do. And that, in turn, means we have criminals in America government. There are those who carried out the act, yes. But there are also those who approved the act. These are also criminals, since 18 USC 2340 holds conspiracy to commit torture as its own criminal offense, punishable by up to 20 years in prison. And then there is the crime of obstructing justice for the individuals who destroyed videotaped evidence of this torture after the September 11 Commission asked for it and members of Congress told them to keep it at the ready for review.
George W. Bush has been protecting criminals. It is now his George W. Bush’s responsibility to stop stonewalling and share the information he has about the commission of the crime of torture, the commission of the crime of conspiracy to commit torture, and the commission of the crime of obstruction of justice.
Michael Mukasey is the Attorney General, sworn to uphold the rule of law. It is now his responsibility to appoint a special prosecutor to investigate the crimes of torture, conspiracy to commit torture, and obstruction of justice.
The Congress can no longer pretend that crimes have not been committed. If George W. Bush will not carry through on his responsibilities, the House now has the responsibility to bring articles of impeachment to the floor. The Senate has the responsibility to follow through on them. And if members of the House and Senate will not carry out their responsibilities, it is time to cast out the lot and replace them with citizens who still believe in the rule of law.
(Source: Washington Post December 11, 2007)
What kind of monster says that strapping a man down, wrapping his face in cellophane, and forcing water down his throat to convince him that he is drowning is not torture?
I say: “DO WHATEVER IT TAKES”….
to you?
So, if doing whatever it takes includes rounding up millions of people in to concentration camps and sending them to die in gas chambers, you’d be for that too, Kathy Ray?
“DO WHATEVER IT TAKES”
Suppose “IT TAKES” flying jets into office buildings?
Suppose “IT TAKES” the use of nuclear weapons, or genocide?
Is there really no limit on what we would do other than the words “IT TAKES?” (In all caps, of course.)
And who decides what “IT TAKES” means, exactly?
… and killing another person without good cause is defined as murder. duh
Ok here’s the deal. I’m completely all for whatever it takes to put the people responsible for 9/11 through misery. However I don’t want people who are innocent to suffer because of what their leaders or people of their religion do. In a way this is like how Hitler rounded up all the Jews and mass murdered and worked them to death. But we have a reason to do this and torture to get information to protect the USA but we should be sure they are directly related to it instead of sterotyping every Muslim or Iraqy with the idiots among them. I am all for torturing those people that need to pay for the 1,000s of deaths.
Actually, Patrick, a report out at the end of last month revealed that the torture of prisoners did not reveal any reliable information – and that Bush White House officials lied when they said that it did. The torture was not only cruel and criminal, it was ineffective as well.
If you are a Christian you must treat others as yo want them to treat you. If someone strikes you, you must turn the other cheek.
If you are for torture, then you are not a Christian
fuck those towelheads that is barely torture and you pussies will all think different when all thos bastards are killing more of our people.
Read MOH “Medal of Honor” Recipient Bud Day’s description of real torture. Next I am not concerned with the water boarding of known Al Quaida terrorist members, what I want to know is why are they still alive?
The waterboarding that is the “Gitmo Baptism” has replaced the use of LSD for the “Clockwork Orange” treatment. An article about it revealed that they are trying to get the water up the nasopharynx, where the vagus trunk emerges. Vagal stimulation wakes up the brain like the psychedelic drug muscarine. These victims are put in what Dr. Stanislav Grof calls “perinatal matrix three” which is Hell itself. But, the torments are suffered in many different bodies by body switching backward and forward in time, thus, Dr. Grof’s organization is called “Grof Transpersonal”. Here is more about this atrocity:
It is said that Jesus “descended into Hell and on the third day arose from the dead”. Crucifixion forces what is called today “holotropic breathing”. Dr. Stanislav Grof replaced LSD with holotropic breathing. LSD awakens brain use beyond the normal 10% by blocking the inhibitory neurons.
Holotropic breathing, and other muscarinic nervous system stimulations, awaken the brain by overriding the inhibitory neurons. The neurons of the parasympathetic nervous system are called “muscarinic” for their stimuilation overriding the inhibitory neurons like the hallucinary drug muscarine.
The major plexuses are called “chakras” in yoga. Stimulation, called “kundalini” in yoga, spreads in any particular nervous system. In the case of the muscarinic nervous system the stimulation spreads to the brain and there awakens more than 10% brain use.
The biggest muscarinic nerve is the vagus nerve. It doesn’t pass through the spine, but, its main trunk emerges from the brain in the roof of the nasopharynx. Advanced yogins have cut the ligature that holds their tongues down so they can put their tongues up the back of their noses.
This act is called the “khechari mudra”, in English, the “fig gesture”. This act causes so much vagal stimulation that the heart stops by vagal syncope. The yogin can then stay in suspended animation for any chosen length of time and voluntarily withdraw his tongue to “resurrect”.
The blood stays oxygenated during the khechari mudra. Houdini did this in some of his feats. But, with the “water board” of the Gitmo Baptism, the intent is to fill the nasopharynx with water, enough just to put the candidate for initiation into what Dr. Stanislav Grof called “perinatal matrix three. Large doses of LSD were used for the same purpose in the “Clockwork Orange” treatment.
Is there any other Hell? Very often those who resurrected from what seemed to witnesses as death, had a homeopathic reaction from death such that the brain woke up with more than its normal 10% use, so that, this actually “hyperlife” state was called, the world of the dead, the Underworld, Hell, etc.
The mind is very powerful to materialize its visualizations as reality in the Underworld. Can anyone control all their thoughts? Things go wrong. as soon as the candidate wishes he were someone else, “zap” he body switches into that someone else, where he no longer has the more than 10% brain use, and is weak again.
But, he doesn’t belong in anyone elses body, so, as soon as that body sleeps or dies, it’s into another body he goes. And, on and on and on, going backward and forward in time in body after body, into everyone he has ever seen, for about a hundred years duration.
This was called the “aioniu amartematos”, an aeon of failure”, in the original Greek Bible, translated into English “etenrnal damnation”. But, Jesus Christ, being God, body switched into everyone who ever was or ever will be, and on every probability timeline. That’s why He is always in you and I. This is real.
The awakened brain accesses the multidimensional universe that people with only 10% brain use are unaware of. It doesn’t have to be that extreme. Perinatal matrix one is euphoric. In perinatal matrix two, the “Knowledge of Good and Evil”, as one goes into this fifth dimensional direction, the brain gets more and more powerful to travel in the sixth dimension to the probability timelines corresponding to imagination.
Dr. Stanislav Grof, in his “Adventure of Self Discovery” said that this was the real sacrament of Baptism, but, it was also what Adam and Eve did with each other, “eating” the fruit of the Knowledge of Good and Evil” that constituted the “original sin” so that the Cathars made this thier sacrament of “Unbaptism”.
Other related stimulations are condemned as “witchcraft”, called in the Koran “blowing on knots”. It’s all how far you go that determines its arbitrary worth to various classes of society. It has been the most suppressed secret in the world. Dr. Grof is the first to get away with making it somewhat public. But, every Christian has the right to understand the crucifixion. It must be common public knowledge for justice.
What is my concern here? I suffered the Clockwork Orange treatment by LSD; and I am an American citizen who never got arrested in my life. As a teenager and nonmember I wrote the supreme “lodge” secret in a high school term paper, got a 98% for it, graduated with honors; but, that term paper was sold in the termpaper black market by the instructor of that class, the wrong people read it, and, they zeroed in on me. It’s like how I got kicked out of “Yahoo Answers”. I was winning big points, the wrong people read it, and I got 200 violation notices in one afternoon, and got suspended.